[Dr. McKay]

Originally Posted by napalm00 They're just adding a parameter (added by Valve in the first place) to a command, whereas you're hooking into their MOTD commands and exploiting them into having to wait to press the Skip button AND kicking them for saying the word "matchmaking" in chat. Who's the one abusing here?

"hooking into their MOTD commands", functionality to do so added by Valve
"having them to wait to press the Skip button", functionality to do so added by Valve
"kicking them for saying the word 'matchmaking' in chat", that plugin was designed as joke, but again, the plugin's ability to function was added by Valve.

Clearly, Valve is the one abusing here.

How many times do I need to repeat the fact that I do not use Pinion? I'm just siding with the server admins in that they get to decide how their server operates. If you don't like it, you're more than welcome on my servers.

[Zephyrus]

Originally Posted by Dr. McKay "hooking into their MOTD commands", functionality to do so added by Valve "having them to wait to press the Skip button", functionality to do so added by Valve "kicking them for saying the word 'matchmaking' in chat", that plugin was designed as joke, but again, the plugin's ability to function was added by Valve. Clearly, Valve is the one abusing here. How many times do I need to repeat the fact that I do not use Pinion? I'm just siding with the server admins in that they get to decide how their server operates. If you don't like it, you're more than welcome on my servers.

Actually none of those functionalities are by valve as they are the result of function hooks and detours

[Dr. McKay]

Originally Posted by Zephyrus Actually none of those functionalities are by valve as they are the result of function hooks and detours

And who do you think implemented the modding interface?

If Valve didn't want people to run ads, they could easily disable it. The fact of the matter is, Valve supports and has partnered with Pinion.

[Smarmy]

This still begs the question in my mind of why one would ever bypass advertisements to play on the servers of those who do things they're so harshly opposed to.

[Zephyrus]

Originally Posted by Dr. McKay And who do you think implemented the modding interface? If Valve didn't want people to run ads, they could easily disable it. The fact of the matter is, Valve supports and has partnered with Pinion.

the modding interface that is not even used by anything but metamod because it sucks so much and needs to be abstracted a lot more? the modding interface that lacks the functionality so badly that you have to detour/hook everything and reverse engineer how stuff works because valve doesnt care? valve even breaks sourcemod with almost every update, makes updates without ANY info for the developers, letting them figure out how to fix their stuff, not even providing a usable sdk and so on... so i wont ever count valve as the source of all these because they barely give an f

[Dr. McKay]

Originally Posted by Zephyrus the modding interface that is not even used by anything but metamod because it sucks so much and needs to be abstracted a lot more? the modding interface that lacks the functionality so badly that you have to detour/hook everything and reverse engineer how stuff works because valve doesnt care? valve even breaks sourcemod with almost every update, makes updates without ANY info for the developers, letting them figure out how to fix their stuff, not even providing a usable sdk and so on... so i wont ever count valve as the source of all these because they barely give an f

So you're saying that Valve shouldn't even have implemented a modding interface at all? It seems that you're the source of more than you let on.

[Horsedick]

There are so many similar instances to this it is too many to name..but its like driving on a road but you shouldn't be subjected to billboards or other signs for advertising. If you don't like it don't take that road, don't look at them..just keep driving a few seconds and keep going.

[Zephyrus]

Originally Posted by Dr. McKay So you're saying that Valve shouldn't even have implemented a modding interface at all? It seems that you're the source of more than you let on.

pinion even uses my code because they suck so bad they have to rely on a competitor's code so blame me for pinion too then, but there are huge differences:

-motdplayer doesnt force wait times, its up to the server owner, pinion does
-motdplayer never crashed the clients with their ads, forcing players to disable their html motds

also i dont care about the ads anyway, i can just disable html motds, use a blacklist or as a clever boy just put them in my hosts config with some random ip, but even all these are unnecessary as in my region nor motdplayer nor pinion has any ads, but at least motdplayer realizes that and lets me continue in a sec while pinion forces me to watch their shit for ~15 secs, also valve provided the matchmaking parameter for the connect command, so its not an abuse according to your views.

also, does this ring a bell: https://forums.alliedmods.net/showthread.php?t=211842 ?

according to you thats totally okay, eating up the bandwith of the player without them knowing at all just because the server owner runs their servers for the money... if donations cant keep up the servers that means theres no need for that many servers, there are way too many communities with 30 servers sharing same setup with a different map, abusing pinion to earn money for the owner, instead of making a good server that would gain donations by simply being awesome and enjoyable to play on

[Powerlord]

Originally Posted by Dr. McKay So you're saying that Valve shouldn't even have implemented a modding interface at all? It seems that you're the source of more than you let on.

As it is, Valve didn't implement much of one and almost everything in SourceMod is the result of binary patching, not using Valve's interfaces.

But hey, feel free to implement it as a VSP using only Valve's own functions (i.e. no binary patching or signature/offset function calls) to prove me wrong. Valve even gave you a new SDK to write them against just a few days ago.

[Dr. McKay]

Originally Posted by Zephyrus -motdplayer doesnt force wait times, its up to the server owner, pinion does

Yet MOTDPlayer has the option. Pinion doesn't force itself on server owners, it's the server owner's choice to install it at all.

Originally Posted by Zephyrus also, does this ring a bell: https://forums.alliedmods.net/showthread.php?t=211842 ? according to you thats totally okay, eating up the bandwith of the player without them knowing at all just because the server owner runs their servers for the money... if donations cant keep up the servers that means theres no need for that many servers, there are way too many communities with 30 servers sharing same setup with a different map, abusing pinion to earn money for the owner, instead of making a good server that would gain donations by simply being awesome and enjoyable to play on

It's the server's decision how it's going to run. Doesn't mean that I agree with it or that it should be used, but it's ultimately the decision of whoever is paying the bills.

I've made my point, I'm debating this no further.