[scout121]

reason i dont like the idea is because these new guns m4, m16, ak, dont require matenience. U could throw and ak into the great salt lake, jump in, and fire that gun underwater. Thats why u dont need a cleaning kit for a simple few hour operation of killing the ts and defusing the bomb. These guns are made to withstand all sorts of conditions.

And taking the time to reload is a long enough time for being completely vulnerable.

[Dygear]

I like the idea, it adds to the game, makes it more realistic.
I dont think that kids will go around killing people, just because they know how to clean a gun, and if you think your kid (from lurning how to clean a gun) will go and shoot up the school, what the hell is your kid doing playing a violent video game in the frist place?


"When you become too realistic people lose the ability to comprehend the difference between what is real and what is fake." - FullThrottle

I totally disagree with this. I am 15, I have been playing game for around 10 years now, and I have been playing video game for around 7 years.

Rant:

The 1st video game that I played was Metal Gear Solid (PSX), If you dont know it, its a pretty violent game. I found the game to be the funnest game I have ever played, and it was not due to the killing (That was pretty much the last thing on my mind, but when I had a bad day, you bet I took it out on the Genome Shoulders) It was just fun creeping around.

I have been playing CS for around 2 years (Witch is pretty young in this community) and I have NEVER once thought of taken a gun to some ones head because I thought I was in the video game. It just does not happen, and the kids who went around killing people (The two brothers who said that they thought they could kill the people in the streets GTA style and they would come back to life) also said GTA tought them how to do it. Well come on now, These kids are A) Lieing (DING DING DING) B) Pshycopaths and really did think that they would came back to life. Come on now, they know that if they said "Well in GTA come back to life" they would get away with it, because the system is fucked up like that. Dont blame the kids for the systems problem(s).

Glad I let that out,
Dygear.

[imported_malex]

Originally Posted by scout121 reason i dont like the idea is because these new guns m4, m16, ak, dont require matenience. U could throw and ak into the great salt lake, jump in, and fire that gun underwater. Thats why u dont need a cleaning kit for a simple few hour operation of killing the ts and defusing the bomb. These guns are made to withstand all sorts of conditions. And taking the time to reload is a long enough time for being completely vulnerable.

AK, M16, new guns? You have an interesting concept of time, my friend. The AK-47 was first put in service in 1949. The M16 went into service in 1964. The M4 is the baby of the bunch, only being a decade old, but it's basically a chopped M16.

It's true the AK-47 withstands dirt and grime well, but that's because the tolerances on it are very loose, making it inaccurate. The more accurate M16 needs much more maintenance, even with its chromed barrell.

\malex\

[Dygear]

Originally Posted by malex even with its chromed barrell.

Yea thats point less. Bling bling M***** F*****s. (Shoots the shit out of the hole T team.)

[imported_malex]

Originally Posted by Dygear Originally Posted by malex even with its chromed barrell. Yea thats point less. Bling bling M***** F*****s.

Chromed barells help prevent fouling. This is a good thing. Hint, the chrome is one the inside.

\malex\

[Dygear]

Yea, er, I knew that. But it was funny while it lasted.

[K2]

Alright, I gotta voice my opinion on this one...

I am head admin for the Hardfought CS: Source servers. I also happen to be an infantry soldier with the US Army, with the 1-27 "Wolfhounds". I am currently deployed in Iraq. I've been here for almost a year, and have seen more than my fair share of IED's, ambushes, fire fights, and so on. I am very lucky that our commo section here is able to keep a satellite link up for us so we can post on the 'net.

Lemme tell ya about the M4A2/4. If you dont clean it on a regular basis, it WILL misfire on you, and often. The carbon deposits left from firing about 3-4 mags worth of ammo is enough to cause enough friction in the barrel that either a round wont load into the chamber fully, or that the spring will stall and the firing pin wont connect with the chambered round.

And dont even talk to me about sand and dust. That's a whole different ball game folks. You want realism? Just imagine if de_dust and dust2 had the typical wind storms that are common in the middle east, and that those sand and dust particles had a direct factor on your ability to fire. Hah.

And the AK-47 is not nearly as reliable as you may think it is, and we thank whatever God there is that that's the case. When time permits, we test fire the different AK's we confiscate from insurgents, and those things misfire like crazy. I can count on one hand how many good quality AK's these guys have available to use. And even then they have their problems too. The AK is a very durable weapon, but it requires maintenence just like any other weapon.

All that being said - I dont think a cleaning kit mod would keep a lot of players on the server. Personally I think it's a good idea if implemented properly, but your average player isnt going to want to have to worry about his weapon jamming up on him because he didnt have the cash to purchase a cleaning kit. I think the implementation would have to be thought out very carefully for that kind of mod to be accepted main stream. And realistically - you'd have to clean your weapon for about one hour for every 5-6 rounds played to get it to standard. I can clean my M4 to where it's combat-ready in about 10 min, but that's taking certain shortcuts.

/my two cents

- K2
http://www.hardfought.org

[imported_malex]

Thank you for your service, K2.

K2, you mentioned it takes it takes 3-4 mags for the M4 to require cleaning, would you know a similar statistic for the AK47?

While it's true properly cleaning a gun would take a long time in real life, that time in game could be made much shorter. Games already compress time greatly; there is no prep, no transportation, no waiting around. 10-15 seconds at the beginning of respawn might work for CS or DOD.

The kit could also be provided to each player, instead of being bought. It would then be up to the player if he wanted to use it.

\malex\

[nolook]

I remember cleaning weapons when I was in the Army. Most soldiers don't like having to do it when they don't use their weapons very often, but when you are on the ground and you need your weapon to work, you'll see more people willing to keep their weapon in top shape. I did a quick Google search and found this image which is similar to what I carried.

[K2]

Yeah that's almost exact to what is issued now. I have a few extras tho, like q-tips, a length of 550 cord gutted with knots tied in it at 2 inch intervals (best bore cleaner around ;) ), a dentists pick and a shaving brush. Canned air that ya use to clean the dust off of your computer works well on certain areas too, but that kind of item is very hard to come by out here.