[Jelle]

There was no use for armor in the 1.18 version. If I understand what he is writing correctly.

[Fr33m@n]

Jelle these servers are really unfair...

beginners have 100, 150 our 200 hp

and best player have 2000 or 3000 hp that suck

[Jelle]

I know. But I once made a server where hp didn't really matter. Just having Dracula was enough.

There beginners had like 2k hp and best player had 20k hp. It is really bugged and did not run smooth at all. However, that was a long time ago. I think that was the first server I ever owned.

[12114]

funny thing is that the server i play on has like 175hp tops (if not counting small hp bonuses), and i still hated that 80% skill damage reduction thing.

[Jelle]

I think that it is cool. I have not seen it on my server yet. However, you do not have so much armor. But you can reach 3k hp if you are max level.

[Fr33m@n]

this problem is not really a problem for me.

you just need to test cvar with another player. player must say how much hp he lost.

[vittu]

Originally Posted by Jelle But vittu, why did you do this. It seems to me like you do not like servers/people who set life to 99999999. What do you have against them?

What I have against them is exactly what Freeman spoke of, new users being deterred because they can never get a kill.

I added the change back in because armor should lessen damage. I mean that is the point of armor otherwise it does nothing except decrease.


I'll have to rethink this. 80% does seem too high, but armor should lessen damage and that is what HL multiplayer sdk uses (we can't check CS specifically). To combat this change you can set damage higher but that would adversely effect users without armor.
I am open to suggestions but not one that goes back to the old way and makes armor pointless. My best guess would be to set max 50% with less if damage is very small (I think CS does something similar to this, but it's also dependent on hitpoint ie vest/helm areas only).

[Jelle]

Originally Posted by vittu What I have against them is exactly what Freeman spoke of, new users being deterred because they can never get a kill. I added the change back in because armor should lessen damage. I mean that is the point of armor otherwise it does nothing except decrease. I'll have to rethink this. 80% does seem too high, but armor should lessen damage and that is what HL multiplayer sdk uses (we can't check CS specifically). To combat this change you can set damage higher but that would adversely effect users without armor. I am open to suggestions but not one that goes back to the old way and makes armor pointless. My best guess would be to set max 50% with less if damage is very small (I think CS does something similar to this, but it's also dependent on hitpoint ie vest/helm areas only).

I can see what you mean there. However, it is impossible to have a low level killing a very high level anyway, in my opinion. This time I made a fast XP (30 levels) and the reset each round, and average level to newcomers, since I really did not know how to balance it properly. That was the best way I could think of.

However, about the armor, as it is in normal cs, I can really not see ANY difference at all with/without armor.

But it is really a good idea to do it that way. It is just dumb not to use it. But maybe just make it 90% of the damage done. 80% seems a bit high to me.

[vittu]

I'm going to set SH_ARMOR_RATIO to 0.5 in the next release, in effect armor will reduce damage by 50% instead of the current 80%. This is what nades seem to do in CS so that is what I'm going to stick with. I will try to test out the reduction (aka SH_ARMOR_BONUS) by nades to see if it should be changed as well.

Note: this reduction is only applied to heroes using the SH_DMG_NORM shextradamage type (which is more than likely only a few heroes that are in the default download, all else would ignore this reduction since recoding the hero would be required to use it).

Originally Posted by Jelle However, about the armor, as it is in normal cs, I can really not see ANY difference at all with/without armor.

Armor helps against nades as I've said above. But with guns it depends on the hit point since helmet and vest only cover head and chest/stomach respectively. From what i can tell armor reduces damage by 50% for guns too, but is dependant on other factors and seems it can be less.

Originally Posted by Jelle But it is really a good idea to do it that way. It is just dumb not to use it. But maybe just make it 90% of the damage done. 80% seems a bit high to me.

Your thinking of it backwards; lower percentage would mean more damage, higher means less damage. If i set it to 90 and damage was 10, after reduction damage would be 1 (if it was 80, damage would be 2).


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My only other guess is that CS reverses the defines from the sdk, making armor reduce damage by 50% (damage * 0.5) and 5 armor points lost per 1 hit point lost (1/.2).
Edit: well after a few test it's not switched, seems like they are both about 0.5. Can't tell exactly because it seems the numbers do change depending on amount of damage.

[Jelle]

Originally Posted by vittu Armor helps against nades as I've said above. But with guns it depends on the hit point since helmet and vest only cover head and chest/stomach respectively. From what i can tell armor reduces damage by 50% for guns too, but is dependant on other factors and seems it can be less.

What I have found out is, if you hit someone in the head, with or without helmet, you would die instantly. If the gun you hit with is a m4. If you hit with TMP, then you wont with or without helmet.
I have never experienced that the hits are reduced because of armor.

Originally Posted by vittu Your thinking of it backwards; lower percentage would mean more damage, higher means less damage. If i set it to 90 and damage was 10, after reduction damage would be 1 (if it was 80, damage would be 2).

No. I am thinking that if you do 80% damage reduction, you will take 2 damage out of a 10 damage hit. But by making it 50%, is that all over the body, or do you make it independent of where you hit?

Originally Posted by vittu My only other guess is that CS reverses the defines from the sdk, making armor reduce damage by 50% (damage * 0.5) and 5 armor points lost per 1 hit point lost (1/.2). Edit: well after a few test it's not switched, seems like they are both about 0.5. Can't tell exactly because it seems the numbers do change depending on amount of damage.

when talking about sdk, what is that? The HL engine, the hlds server?
Also. If armor goes down by 5 each 1 damage you get, then why do you never end on 0 armor before you die?
If you die by a m4 shot in the head, doing around 120 damage, you end with like 75 armor. That is only 25 armor witch is lost.