AlliedModders

AlliedModders (https://forums.alliedmods.net/index.php)
-   Off-Topic (https://forums.alliedmods.net/forumdisplay.php?f=15)
-   -   Tower Defense (https://forums.alliedmods.net/showthread.php?t=48758)

stupok 12-20-2006 19:57

Re: Tower Defense
 
http://xs510.xs.to/xs510/06514/stupoktower.PNG.xs.jpg

The plan doesn't suck, that's my highest score so far.

Putting towers on the ends really does have an odd effect. I don't know what else to do to get the edge. The flower is probably worthless. The clouds are completely worthless.

sawce 12-20-2006 22:25

Re: Tower Defense
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Zenith77 (Post 417752)
wow your plan sucks

??? Elaborate.

The only thing that sucks about going all green is its kind of hard to start with only a green and keep it in a spot that will be useful later on. I start here:
http://xs110.xs.to/xs110/06514/greenstart.jpg.xs.jpg

It works well later on, the only thing about starting there is you have to upgrade really fast (as in, right when the kill to earn the money is made) or some can slip through.

Emp` 12-20-2006 22:57

Re: Tower Defense
 
[img]http://img327.**************/img327/690/towerszo7.jpg[/img]
started with red circle. got 1 upgrade, then built the 1 all the way at the top. then worked both of the upgrades to the top, then started to build elsewhere.

the blue are where i double builded (apparently you can do that)

and the green is where one of mine disappeard :-/ (a seed was on the map instead)

sawce 12-20-2006 23:05

Re: Tower Defense
 
Id avoid the green circle and one all the way to the right, and i dont try double stacking because of the vanish issue (even when you dont double stack, if its close it can sometimes vanish... it happened to me on wave 75 before)

BAILOPAN 12-20-2006 23:06

Re: Tower Defense
 
sawce you should teach Tower Defense 101 at a university

stupok 12-20-2006 23:10

Re: Tower Defense
 
The red circle in Emp's snapshot is the best starting point if you're going with green. You can last with a single tower all the way to max upgrade without losing any civ's if you put it there.

New High Score:
http://xs110.xs.to/xs110/06514/stupoktower2.PNG.xs.jpg

With flowers, I only got to 75, but they weren't positioned quite right. Awful expensive upgrades, but they are cheaper than a fully upgraded nature tower.

Liquidz 12-21-2006 00:10

Re: Tower Defense
 
I went a different way and got me to level 70.

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d1...Adam/score.jpg

Meh highest i ever got.:)

Twilight Suzuka 12-21-2006 02:22

Re: Tower Defense
 
My highest was 85 or so.

The level one flower actually has more damage/range ratio per dollar than the green at max, but placement is difficult.

In order to get a third tier flower, one has to use as little as one unit for as long as possible (I can go up to level 50), and then place a flower, and hope to god you can get it before being overrun.

Twilight Suzuka 12-21-2006 02:37

Re: Tower Defense
 
In the interest of fairness, let me explain what these stats mean before hand.

Success in Tower Defense is limited to a certain upper bound (which I have not quite established), because two competing factors inevitably intersect:

Enemy health: Exponential (1.25^n)
Allied Money: Linear (60 + (x * n) )

Exponential growth inevitably overwhelms linear growth, so unless I am wrong about money growing linearly (it could grow based on the amount of damage dealt to the enemies, which is also exponential). However, signs and observations dictate that, at some point, money begins to run out and things get increasingly harder to build. This shows there is some upper limit.

Now, this means that to maximize how far we can go in Tower Defense, we have to maximize how much damage we do per dollar, as we start to quickly run out of dollars in later levels, and in earlier levels we don't get much to begin with anyway!

However, if we gauge purely by how much damage we do per dollar, we ignore the range factor, and get false readings. For the purposes of the statistics, I have assumed that range is a linear scale, which observation confirms. To elaborate, range is a multiplier that arises through this: (range / 100).

Of course, merely calculating the damage|range per dollar is not sufficient to explain HOW to maximize Tower Defense returns, but it does show what the resulting placements should look like.

On to the stats!

Code:

Lightning        Damage        Range        $  Lvl $  Dmg per $        BVR
Deployment        40        100        40    40      1          1

Code:

Fire                Dmg        Range        $        Lvl $        Dmg/$        BVR
Deployment        4        100        18        18        0.22        0.22
Level Two        12        100        20        38        0.32        0.32
Level Three        36        110        30        68        0.53        0.58
Level Four        108        150        50        118        0.92        1.37
Level Five        300        160        80        198        1.52        2.42
Level Six        2056        190        600        798        2.58        4.9
Level Max        7021        200        1500        2298        3.06        6.11

Code:

Water                Dmg        Range        $        Lvl $        Dmg/$        BVR
Deployment        5        100        10        10        0.5        0.5
Level Two        15        150        20        30        0.5        0.75
Level Three        45        150        40        70        0.64        0.96
Level Four        135        180        80        150        0.9        1.62
Level Five        405        200        160        310        1.31        2.61
Level Six        1215        200        320        630        1.93        3.86
Level Seven        3342        200        730        1360        2.46        4.91
Level Eight        6684        215        1000        2360        2.83        6.09
Level Max        7335        300        1000        3360        2.18        6.55

Code:

Nature                Dmg        Range        $        Lvl $        Dmg/$        BVR
Deployment        5        100        15        15        0.33        0.33
Level Two        10        100        20        35        0.29        0.29
Level Three        45        110        40        75        0.6        0.66
Level Four        136        150        80        155        0.88        1.32
Level Five        405        160        160        315        1.29        2.06
Level Six        1215        190        320        635        1.91        3.64
Level Seven        3645        200        640        1275        2.86        5.72
Level Max        9000        215        1100        2375        3.79        8.15

Code:

Flower                Dmg        Range        $        Lvl $        Dmg/$        BVR
Deployment        9090        150        2000        2000        4.55        6.82
Level Two        15050        100        5000        7000        2.15        2.15
Level Three        909090        90        15000        22000        41.32        37.19

Damage, range, $ (cost) are simple to understand. The next column is total level damage, which is the accumulations of costs till that level. Next over is damage per dollar, raw, which is the raw damage per dollar ratio. The last column is with range factored in.

As you can see, excluding third tier flower, the highest damage per dollar is the first tier flower. Factoring in range, the nature max outruns it by a healthy margin however.

Third tier flower rapes all other values; this is the thing to aim for in the end game.

Conclusions:
Lightning outbeats all others for a significant number of levels, 3 across the board. It can be used as a quick stopgap measure, but fire outruns it as a stop gap measure, for a pretty small price increase.

Fire is the best deal in the middle game. It has a very low cost, under 1000, for a rather high BVR of around 5, and can be built quickly. However, its end game is the lowest of the three mains, and thus shouldn't be used except as a stop gap measure.

Notes: Use as stop gap in endgame

Water is the lowest dmg/$ of all in the max level, however with range factored in, is beat only by the green max. However, the additional range MAY be a factor, in placement.

Notes: Placement can render a higher amount of damage in endgame.

Nature has the highest BVR, which factors in range, and thus in the end game is the most economical. However, its dmg/$ is low UNTIL the end game; its second to last level is comparable to fires second to last level, despite such a higher cost. Nature is the way to go for the end game, but not for stop gap measures.

Notes: Best value, without factoring in placement. Try to put at end of hallway.

Flower has the highest in the end game (which is almost unobtainable), and is the only one to go DOWN when leveling up. The first tier is comparable to the max of nature, though at a reduced cost (which doesn't really matter, as it is insignificant). Unfortunately, the range means it sucks in the end game.

Notes: Get the third tier flower. WINRAR.

Next up: Placement notes.

Twilight Suzuka 12-21-2006 03:54

Re: Tower Defense
 
New: Algorithm for coming up with health and income.

_root.health = _root.health * 1.1 + _root.wave * 8.6;

_root.income = _root.income * 0.02 + _root.wave * 1.1;

Ok, so I was slightly wrong. Health grows exponentially, but income grows logarithmically.

Why?
n^8.6 + 25^1.1n = health
n^1.1 + 60^0.01n = income

That kind of exponential can be written as a logarithm, but I won't go into it. The point is, income quickly becomes bounded, while health is unbounded.

Thanks to KoST for this info. More to come.


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 20:08.

Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.