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BAILOPAN
03-16-2010, 03:07
Assuming Valve's upcoming Mac port isn't an April Fool's prank (we haven't gotten a reply from them on any questions), we are planning on doing a port. To get an idea of how high priority it should be, and whether we should invest in hardware, we're conducting a little poll.

Vote below and tell us if, and how, you're gonna use Steam on your Mac.

Thanks!

Bacardi
03-16-2010, 04:30
Never MAC...

hehe youtube
Newton Virus - Art virus for Mac
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBJQ5085kSo

DontWannaName
03-16-2010, 04:36
I would wonder how well srcds will run on a mac server vs linux and windows. I would rather see a decompiler, lol jk.

Cerise
03-16-2010, 09:02
If optimized well, would run servers and play games on it.

Although im fine with running servers on linux and playing on windows.

papyrus_kn
03-16-2010, 09:04
Never MAC...

Munra
03-16-2010, 10:23
Are they even going to port the server software?

tcviper
03-16-2010, 11:01
As far as we know only the client... so this doesnt make sense. All mac clients will connect to PC servers. Unless once again I missed something :p

tcviper
03-16-2010, 11:12
If optimized well, would run servers and play games on it.

Although im fine with running servers on linux and playing on windows.

You can also play on a mac and connect to pc servers anyway ;)

ulx
03-16-2010, 12:05
Never MAC...

same here.

... Although im fine with running servers on linux and playing on windows.

same here. its simply well established and for me there's no need for a change.

1nsane
03-16-2010, 12:49
The poll is lacking a "No, but I will look through the Mac Source Engine client for symbols" option :/.

V0gelz
03-16-2010, 13:01
Mac and Servers, i don't see why not? :O

DontWannaName
03-16-2010, 13:32
If they support the game then they support the create a server option in the game which usually means that the server tool will support it too.

Afronanny
03-16-2010, 13:32
I actually laughed when I saw the word "Mac" in the title. No I don't have a mac, no I never will have a mac, and I think porting SM to Mac would increase the amount of n00bs asking redundant questions significantly. If it were up to me, I'd keep SM at Linux and Windows only, no mac. But that's just my opinion.

PMAvers
03-16-2010, 13:48
Yeah, I do. Plan on nuking my Win7 partition when the OS X version of Steam comes out and moving back over full-time.

Probably won't run a server on it, since my TF2 server's on a hosting company, but having the option out there will never hurt anything.

Jamster
03-16-2010, 14:10
I don't think catering to it is a bad idea but I guess it depends on how many people would run Mac servers (which I guess is what you are trying to find out!).

SirLamer
03-16-2010, 14:16
Running a poll on this subject here is obviously a poor idea. Everyone who uses this forum has a PC, and many have no reason to switch to using a Mac. This new Steam feature is about opening up to a new untapped market - they don't use this forum yet. :P

1nsane
03-16-2010, 14:27
Bailopan, don't you use a mac? If so, wouldn't that make testing easier AND faster for you? If you could just run the server, game and any other needed tools natively.

psychonic
03-16-2010, 14:32
http://asia.cnet.com/i/r/2007/pp/62035397/top-10-terrible-technologies-6.jpg

SuperShadow
03-16-2010, 14:46
The new Apple mice don't have any buttons: http://store.apple.com/us/product/MB829LL/A?fnode=MTY1NDA1Mg&mco=MTMzNzY2NTE
http://myjyd.com/ss/magic_mouse.jpg
Oh, and I'm a PC!

Munra
03-16-2010, 14:56
If they support the game then they support the create a server option in the game which usually means that the server tool will support it too.

I doubt it

They might do listen servers but mac has no market in dedicated servers so I doubt the DS will be ported. No where have they said they are going port the tools (programs under the tools tab) also.

pedrofranceschi
03-16-2010, 16:14
Yeah! I have a Mac, and I'd like the SourcePawn compiler for Mac! Where can I find it? I can compile it here, but when I require some file, I got an error.

I hope you help me, Bailopan.

Thanks!

Bacardi
03-16-2010, 16:22
Hey guess what ? When this happen, we get more steam updates !! WO¨HOO
Neve ever endin updates <3

-999-
03-16-2010, 18:12
The question would be what would the benefit of it versus the amount of complexity/work it's going to require? To my knowledge, there aren't any gsp's that have Mac servers, and no larger tier providers I've dealt with (the planet, etc) offer dedicated Mac servers. So you'd basically be catering, to people who want to run servers out of their homes, on a Mac.

I'd say the negatives outweigh the positives. But then again I think porting Steam, etc, to the Mac is dumb in the first place.

Jamster
03-16-2010, 18:27
I can't believe people have voted down this thread. :\

Anyway, note that I hate to derail this a tiny bit but Valve are not doing the Mac stuff on a whim, the Mac share of the overall market now is growing pretty rapidly, hell, even EA games cater to it now (not as well as Valve is going to, granted). Valve are making their presence felt before the inevitable push eventually by Apple themselves into the games distribution field (Apple like owning everything themselves for their market).

To the thread though I think this is a "pan out and see" issue, if Valve make it so srcds will run on Mac then I think that's fair enough, it probably needs to be ported. Otherwise if it's just listen servers (i.e. done through the client) that Valve make only available I probably wouldn't bother unless it's really easy for the SM team.

I'd definitely like to see how Source games play on the Mac just for shits and giggles anyway. A lot of Mac gamers at the moment use boot camp or whatever just to play TF2 and stuff so I know many people happy by the news with Steam going native, so to speak.

BAILOPAN
03-16-2010, 19:48
We're not really interested in the silly comments about the validity of Macs or using Macs. Three of the SM developers use them. Save your breath - if there's a Steam port, there will be a SourceMod port.

This poll is to estimate how much demand there will be. The results so far are actually better than I'd expect - a little higher than the market share of Macs in general. That's cool, and it's great if software is accessible to more platforms.

pedrofranceschi: Post a thread or bug report about what's not working, please. I am able to use spcomp on OS X.

SirLamer: Thank you for explaining to me that most people answering the poll don't run SourceMod on OS X, and then making wild assumptions based on no data. You deserve some sort of prize, but I'm all out. Sorry.

Mnkras
03-16-2010, 20:26
Personally i play the graphic intensive games on my PC but L4D isn't that graphic intensive, so i guess im going to play, Since Mac is unix it shouldn't take to much work to bundle the linux distro.

BAILOPAN
03-16-2010, 21:02
Munra: We are assuming clients will have the ability to create listen servers. We don't know if there will be dedicated servers - I sure hope so!

Like everything with Valve, we'll play it by ear. There's no reason to assume anything from them will exist until it's in your hands.

Crimson_Fox
03-16-2010, 22:49
I don't own a mac, but I do know of a couple of people that will use Steam on mac. If Steam and Source get ported to Linux I'd get rid of my Windows partition altogether.

EHG
03-17-2010, 10:05
Never MAC...

soreloser
03-17-2010, 10:21
hell YES!

Munra
03-17-2010, 10:32
Munra: We are assuming clients will have the ability to create listen servers. We don't know if there will be dedicated servers - I sure hope so!

Like everything with Valve, we'll play it by ear. There's no reason to assume anything from them will exist until it's in your hands.

I had a good convo with FlyingMongoose last night on IRC and your are both right, no telling what valve will do. I do think its great that they are porting it to mac.

zeroibis
03-17-2010, 13:19
I just hope that they do not break the game for us while trying to get it to work on mac...

While I understand that people would want dedicated server on mac support for testing it seems pointless b/c it is not as though you would actually rent a mac dedicated server to host your game in a datacenter. Unless it is somehow way more stable than srcds runs in winserver 05 and cost less than linux and the odds of that are virtually 0.

karuru
03-17-2010, 13:55
still waiting for the announcement of an linux client ;)

AtomicStryker
03-17-2010, 15:23
No, and i never understood the rage about it. Looks like Linux with one hell of a Price Tag to me.


*runs away*

Chanz
03-17-2010, 15:33
I see this somehow very critical.

It's always good to provide software platform independent, but on the other hand many users of this forum try to make their plugins etc. dependent.

The biggest example for this are the L4D tagged plugins. So many of them could work for more mods than just l4d or l4d2, but the developers of those plugins don't have time, don't have any other mod than l4d or are just too lazy to make their plugin platform/mod independent.

So do we see now threads like '[MAC][L4D3] Spawn weapons XYZ'?

psychonic
03-17-2010, 15:47
The biggest example for this are the L4D tagged plugins. So many of them could work for more mods than just l4d or l4d2, but the developers of those plugins don't have time, don't have any other mod than l4d or are just too lazy to make their plugin platform/mod independent.

So do we see now threads like '[MAC][L4D3] Spawn weapons XYZ'?

Mod-dependence and OS-dependence are completely different. For example, all approved plugins are OS-agnostic (the only semi-exception is ones that only include gamedata for a single OS, but the plugin itself will still run under any OS, provided the correct data is available).

There are many plugins written for single games that can work in other games with little/no edits, but that's not really relevant.

zeroibis
03-17-2010, 16:05
I think this sums up how people with mac will feel when valve releases this update: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8FnACj25xM

Also I think that the move to mac may be a signal that valve is looking toward opengl4 and not dx11 for future game releases.

InflatableSoulmate
03-17-2010, 19:41
A lot of people run hidden srcds servers on the corporate networks they administrate. Some of these networks may have Apple Xservs, and newer Xservs are pretty nice machines. Why wouldn't someone be interested in running srcds on a Mac, and if so, why wouldn't they have a high probability of wanting to be able to use SourceMod?

Obviously, it *could* be considered a waste of time, because GSPs aren't going to spend all that extra money just to get Apple servers, but is that really a reason not to support it?

naris
03-17-2010, 22:04
I don't use macs myself. However, since linux and Mac's OS/X are both unix derivatives, porting from linux to OS/X shouldn't be very difficult so you might as well "port" it...

Crispy
03-18-2010, 02:52
Yes, I have a Mac, and I'm looking forward to being able to play TF2 without having to boot into Windows. However, I just recently went on a OMG gotta have it buying spree, and spent a small fortune on a Sun X2270. With Debian installed, this box runs my TF2 and TeamSpeak servers beautifully, so I doubt that I will be running any servers under OSX in the near or distant future.

walterbrunswick
03-19-2010, 00:31
Don't waste time with Macs.

Make a Linux port, and you're done.

BAILOPAN
03-19-2010, 05:46
most statistics i can find, suggest that mac has roughly 5-6X more user market share than linux

i'll need an economics phd to analyze this business decision further

Jamster
03-19-2010, 13:04
most statistics i can find, suggest that mac has roughly 5-6X more user market share than linux

i'll need an economics phd to analyze this business decision further

hahaha

recon0
03-19-2010, 20:28
A lot of people run hidden srcds servers on the corporate networks they administrate. Some of these networks may have Apple Xservs, and newer Xservs are pretty nice machines. Why wouldn't someone be interested in running srcds on a Mac, and if so, why wouldn't they have a high probability of wanting to be able to use SourceMod?

You mean newbs who don't know how to run virtualization software :P

I don't have anything against supporting more platforms, but I have to ask... Which SM developers use Macs?


Requisite PC vs Mac Flame: Hello, I'm a PC. Macs aren't any better, and Linux isn't and may never be ready for the desktop. /end reality check

BAILOPAN
03-19-2010, 22:43
hawk, let's pretend i'm your college adviser for... whatever, and we're in sitting in a room or something. i'm behind a desk and you're sitting in one of those college chairs that wasn't really designed for humans to sit in.

my advice to you is to find something better to do with your time than publicly tell people things like they "choke on their own spit."

this is my subtle hint to stop post inflammatory bullshit

Bishop
03-20-2010, 08:16
To be quite honest I have not touched my Mac since my beginning days in programming... and trust me bad things happen when I play around with that. Then again I could some money never paying for internet again... nah I should leave it in the closet.

InflatableSoulmate
03-21-2010, 12:49
You mean newbs who don't know how to run virtualization software :P

I don't have anything against supporting more platforms, but I have to ask... Which SM developers use Macs?


Requisite PC vs Mac Flame: Hello, I'm a PC. Macs aren't any better, and Linux isn't and may never be ready for the desktop. /end reality check

Sure, maybe. But if you are working on a corporate Xserve, and you go to load up a completely different OS in a VM, you are using up whatever resources you allocated to that VM, which has to run the OS, the srcds server, and all the supporting shit that windows or linux would require to run srcds. Why not just run a native OS X binary?

If you're already virtualizing windows or linux on the Xserve, then there was no reason to care about a Mac OS X native application in the first place.

BAILOPAN
03-21-2010, 13:57
recon0: I do. The others can step forward on their own unless they want to save face ;)

API
03-21-2010, 15:17
Just an opinion: Aren't Mac computers designed for Video Editting, etc? I see absolutely no reason NOT to support it for servers, imagine playing on a server with like 30 gigs of RAM :P

recon0
03-21-2010, 16:29
recon0: I do. The others can step forward on their own unless they want to save face ;)
I knew it. They seem to be in with people who work on web related software (not sure why).

Do you use / like it for your general day to day computing (which I imagine includes programming, gaming, browsing, etc)? I was thinking of getting a Mac, but I wasn't sure if I'd really be able to do everything (programming, gaming, browsing, etc) on one. I figured I'd need CrossOver or Parallels for some stuff, but that raised the question, why not just run Windows?

Just an opinion: Aren't Mac computers designed for Video Editting, etc? I see absolutely no reason NOT to support it for servers, imagine playing on a server with like 30 gigs of RAM :P
Windows servers can have more RAM than that ;)

devicenull
03-21-2010, 16:54
Windows servers can have more RAM than that ;)

My desktop can technically handle up to 4 petabytes of ram :)

API
03-21-2010, 16:59
Yeah, I guess that is a good point recon0 and dn. I still think that cross-platform support is important, so I still vote for 'yes' on Mac of course :)

DaFox
03-21-2010, 17:28
Don't waste time with Macs.

Make a Linux port, and you're done.

There is already a linux port. I see no reason not to support every platform that Source runs on that has the plugin interface. (read: not 360/PS3)

Just an opinion: Aren't Mac computers designed for Video Editting, etc? I see absolutely no reason NOT to support it for servers, imagine playing on a server with like 30 gigs of RAM :P

Macs are designed to be general purpose computers with a sense of style.

They just happen to be used for multimedia stuff quite often because the style and applications attract artists.

I voted No on the poll but who knows I might try out a hackintosh one day and I would definitely try some Source games on it.

but that raised the question, why not just run Windows?

Most people who run OSX don't need any Windows apps. Thats why you rarely see OSX gamers.

BAILOPAN
03-21-2010, 17:43
recon0: My time is split equally between the three major operating systems. I usually prefer OS X for development and day-to-day stuff. I don't play games very often (maybe once every few months), but for when I do, or I need to read crash dumps/test Steam, I use a Windows desktop.

For about a year I used OS X almost exclusively, but doing high-load testing on a laptop, on VMWare, is a real chore. And performance testing in VMWare is not a good idea.

The unfortunate thing is that it's not legal to put OS X on non-Apple hardware. So my really-beefy Dell machine is "stuck" with Linux, since I prefer Unix development environments. But when you spend 75% of your day in vim, and 25% in a web browser, everything looks the same (except Windows, where the console subsystem sucks).

DS
03-21-2010, 19:53
I suppose I'll chime in. I'm one of the other developers that was mentioned, I think.

However, I'm currently using a "Hackintosh" which is working rather well for me. I dual boot between OS X (Snow Leopard) and Windows 7, but I find myself in OS X most of the time as of late. I certainly wouldn't mind owning a MacBook Pro in the future though.

I don't play games as much as I used to, so my reason for using Windows is usually development-related. If we are really getting dedicated servers besides the client, I'm sure my reboots into Windows will be getting even fewer.

pRED*
03-22-2010, 03:44
I have *no* idea who the third is...

BAILOPAN
03-22-2010, 04:41
I'm Spartacus!

DaFox
03-22-2010, 05:32
The unfortunate thing is that it's not legal to put OS X on non-Apple hardware.

Legalities don't stop the rest of us ;)

Edit, as long as you own a legal copy of it of course. RIGHT DS?

AntiBots
03-22-2010, 11:16
I will like to have a MAC!!!!! Someone help me xD

nightrider
03-22-2010, 21:51
I run a dedicated windows server with 12 srcds installs professionally collocated.
I use a Macintosh for graphics work & layout design.
I'm sure I would find use for a OSX port of the dedicated server engine with Sourcemod.

:)

triggerman
03-22-2010, 23:48
Never MAC...

retsam
03-23-2010, 02:58
Whats a MAC? Is that a burger?

Bishop
03-23-2010, 11:21
I'm still running MS DOS >.> .... not really but I still have an old ass comp that still runs it. Its great for playing the floppy disc DOOM :) ( and for those who never seen... its no the 3.5 inch floppies you may seem time to time. )

Xanimos
03-23-2010, 21:23
I have no use for a MAC. I accomplish everything I need to with a nice linux build just fine.

Rul4
03-25-2010, 22:47
Well, I use a MAC for working (yep, that also involves coding, and nope, I don't do any web stuff) and also for gaming under Crossover Games (ie: Wine on steroids). I found out that was much more comfortable than the Windows partition I had only for gaming, so my windows partition is now gone.
I will certainly welcome a native port of steam (and metamod).
From the little coding of plugins I've done in this forum, I have to tell you that the Amxx Studio works like crap under Crossover... I ended up using XCode.
BTW, my mouse is a nice Razer gaming mouse that works wonderfully under Snow Leopard.:mrgreen:

ggo-team.com
03-26-2010, 12:40
Of course i do xD

NightLinks
03-26-2010, 16:43
I don't own a mac yet but now that steam is going to be available for mac I might get one.

ServO
03-26-2010, 18:59
Whats a MAC? Is that a burger?
Well, i think it's a PC, lol

Bacardi
03-26-2010, 19:00
Mac - half bite apple
http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:Z129C5Xf4Q2vhM:http://technomarketer.typepad.com/technomarketer//apple%2520with%2520bite%2520taken.gif

M249-M4A1
03-26-2010, 22:08
mac sux end of story

Küspert
03-27-2010, 12:17
Think I would do both … play and run a server :)

1nsane
03-27-2010, 12:51
Valve has an application page up:
http://store.steampowered.com/macbeta/

Maybe the OSX using SM team should apply :D.

Citrixlemon
03-29-2010, 12:16
I'd like to think that supporting Mac will not be a high priority, firstly because of the overwhelming number of NO votes, but also because since Mac and PC players will be playing on the same servers supposedly, it would be better to keep Sourcemod on one platform.

Note: this is all assuming that porting to Mac would take away from time developing for PC. If it's somehow really easy to port to a Mac then go right ahead in my opinion.

naris
03-30-2010, 03:12
it would be better to keep Sourcemod on one platform.

SourceMod is ALREADY on 2 platforms, Windows and Linux. Also, The Mac's OS/X is also a Unix derivative, similar to Linux, so adding support for OS/X should not be that big a deal...

M249-M4A1
03-30-2010, 23:10
what is this filth that is on my avatar / signature!!! lol pred

oh yeah and the passing dlc is delayed... gotta love valve

TheNewt
04-01-2010, 10:47
Mac build, do it. :)

untamed0
04-13-2010, 15:07
I don't have a Mac, and I don't see the point of this? I don't know of ANY dedicated server providers that offer OSX as standard, and I'm guessing Valve wouldn't limit Mac users to Mac only servers (as that would just be stupid) so the only people who would use it are people running home servers to mess around on, which is a very VERY small amount of people. I think it would be better to invest the time it would take instead into making SM better.

BAILOPAN
04-13-2010, 16:07
I don't have a Mac, and I don't see the point of this?

Aha.

BAILOPAN
04-13-2010, 18:13
If Valve ports HL2 to your wrist watch, yes!

FaTony
04-14-2010, 00:38
If Valve ports HL2 to your wrist watch, yes!

Should we write an online petition and spam all hl2-related forums?

SaintK
04-16-2010, 04:28
I had written a lengthy post here, but after re-reading it 3 times i felt i am unable to get my toughs translated into text the way i want too.

In short, i think SM should support the MAC platform. In my opinion the broader the support, the more users (the more the merry, right?). Also i think its important to bring support as it will help in future decisions on multi-platform support from (game)dev's. After all, if VALVe releases the MAC port, and no one would use it, why should they consider supporting other OS'ses in the future?

And as last, to quote BAILOPAN, "FORWARD, ALWAYS FORWARD!"

Cheers,

BasouKazuma
04-17-2010, 13:17
I thought the noobs in the games I played were bad enough ... having Mac noobs enter the playing field will just make things worse.

Though that's a Valve issue so supporting or not supporting Mac for Sourcemod will not affect this. I'm sure you'll get nagged by people to support it anyway but, then again, most Mac users aren't tech savvy enough to set this stuff up.

D-Skript
04-17-2010, 20:30
Macs are shit.

The009
04-18-2010, 02:15
Just because people own a mac isn't a bad thing, the only reason i have Windows is because of games and a few programs.

I hate windows, and mac all the same, I'm a Linux junky.

Should you port over to mac and spend the $$ I would say not until the market is big enough for it.

I don't see many people running "Dedicated" mac servers for dedicated or even colo server.

I think you have the biggest market covered by using windows and linux support.

nightrider
04-18-2010, 21:41
So much platform bashing.
If Valve supports a dedicated server for OS X then mods will be developed.

BAILOPAN
04-19-2010, 00:01
I don't see many people running "Dedicated" mac servers for dedicated or even colo server.

Neither do I. The hardware is expensive so there would have to be significant cost savings somewhere else. The question wasn't really aimed at GSPs or people renting/buying professional hardware. It was more aimed at homebrew setups - people who would prefer to do testing and development on OS X (like me), or have Macs in their computing environment and want to run servers off them.

SeToY
04-19-2010, 06:10
Never MAC...

Geek_Loco
04-21-2010, 21:52
I have 2 Linux router/gateway systems, a Vista and 2 Win7 laptops, Win7 gaming desktop, Vista desktop to run CSS, TF2, L4D and L4D2 servers, and a Mac Mini. I don't use the Mac as much as I would like to and if I could off load the game servers to the Mac Mini, it would be a good power savings over running the desktop 24/7. The servers are used less by the general public than by my clan and for testing mods and settings. I would very much want SM if the servers were ported to Mac. :up:

Black Haze
04-23-2010, 14:19
Never MAC...

I'll even auto-ban Mac users on my servers when it comes out...

Black Haze
04-23-2010, 14:27
I had written a lengthy post here, but after re-reading it 3 times i felt i am unable to get my toughs translated into text the way i want too.

In short, i think SM should support the MAC platform. In my opinion the broader the support, the more users (the more the merry, right?). Also i think its important to bring support as it will help in future decisions on multi-platform support from (game)dev's. After all, if VALVe releases the MAC port, and no one would use it, why should they consider supporting other OS'ses in the future?

And as last, to quote BAILOPAN, "FORWARD, ALWAYS FORWARD!"

Cheers,

Why would anyone WANT coders to code for Mac? Please, PLEASE Let this Mac experiment fail!

I don't want coders to have to take time for *eugh* Mac, time that they could use to further develop the games for the real platform.

Even worse, what if they have to leave certain things out because the *eugh* Mac can't run it? Mac's aren't really known for their superior hardware, though the Mac freaks would like to have you believe it.

They're just not worth it.

BAILOPAN
04-23-2010, 14:52
Weird!

pRED*
04-23-2010, 19:31
Cute.

BAILOPAN
04-23-2010, 20:08
I'm going to lock this thread. There will be a Mac port, if you don't like it, don't use it.

I'm kind of shocked to see vitriol here, and it won't be tolerated when it comes time to support the new platform.